@letters_inthesand: Ohhh where to even start with this. First of all, the conversation in question happened about 4 years ago, so it's not a particular recent thing. It was over messaging so I have all the receipts and I tend to go back and read it over a couple times a year because honestly, now it makes me laugh. Not because it's funny but because of the audacity. For context, both of the men in this conversation were self-proclaimed feminists and one especially tended to be praised a lot for his progressive beliefs. The "debate" started when a girl came into this chat, upset because she had been publicly harassed by a man, and then another spoke on her own experiences being catcalled and followed when she's alone. One man responded with the quote in the video ("you guys just attract them") and THEN the crowd goes wild. The entire conversation turned into two men complaining about misandry and how uncomfortable it is for THEM that women are sometimes afraid of them, or that women sometimes say "I hate men" when a man does an objectively shitty thing which is apparently the misandrist equivalent to historic and societal sexism against women? They turned the whole conversation into a "debate" which nobody agreed to and then became condescending when any of the women had the nerve to get upset or angry ("let's keep this civil"). One of them compared his home life, i.e. getting raised by his mother and grandmother, to systemic gendered oppression. They took a statement about a woman's very real and very recent harassment as an indictment of themselves personally, blamed her and the other girls in the group chat, and then had the audacity to beg for reassurance that they weren't misogynistic and that "not all men" (especially not us pls). Also because intersectionality is important, especially in a conversation like this, it's important to note that both of these men are white, cis, and straight. Also the reason I am writing a song about this now, instead of four years ago, is because I've finally got to the point where I am both angry about it and find it funny. At the time, we all heard them out, had their "civil debate" and moved on as if it was fine. Now I look back on it not only mad at them, but at myself for being less emotional. Women should get angry, they should get defensive, and I wish I had been less accomodating. I even ended up apologising for my role in making them feel uncomfortable in female dominated environments which is ridiculous. I'm also much better at writing songs now. To this day, I'm sure those boys saw no consequences for their beliefs, and learned nothing. They'll still be getting praise for their "feminist" views, and they will still regard themselves as one of the good guys. But as a woman put very well during this conversation "misogyny is more than just thinking women are beneath you". No, I do not believe these men will ever be violent towards a woman, nor would I personally be afraid to be alone with them, but you don't get a medal for that. And you don't get a pass to ignore real harassment and reframe it as an attack towards you, just because you perceive yourself as innocent and separate from societal misogyny. I certainly hope they have grown and learned, but I doubt it. If you don't think you're doing anything wrong, why would you change? Now, to make everyone feel better, here's a list of quotes from the women in the chat that I also love: - "My 55 year old dad just called you a victim blamer" (man: "it's the worst when women are instantly defensive") Woman: "not all women :) - "If I'm scared it's because I don't know if I'm in real danger. At least if I'm the scary one I know I'm not going to hurt anyone. - "I find it weird that only when women complain about their problems, will men start about how their problems are not being talked about. Why is it up to women to include you when discussing their own issues?" I'm running out of characters so bye #originalsong #fyp #feminism #folksong

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Tuesday 16 June 2026 19:38:13 GMT